Three New Airports

ebik · Post by **ebik** » 28 Mar 2006 07:07

richk67 wrote:OK, Ive nearly solved it, and you will be able to get your aircraft back too. The blocking aircraft is Aircraft 24 on Term8. It wants the hangar and has reserved it. But it cant leave cos Aircraft 12 has reserved the taxiway. I can override this by giving Aircraft 24 the taxiway as well.

Thank you very much. The reason why I played old version of the patch is, that I tried not to compile windows binary. I tried new version in linux, but the computer with best screen has no linux on it. (This is only my lazyness, as I will use it when I install it there. Maybe I'll install it to compile this and other projects...)

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 28 Mar 2006 09:13

ebik wrote:Thank you very much. The reason why I played old version of the patch is, that I tried not to compile windows binary. I tried new version in linux, but the computer with best screen has no linux on it. (This is only my lazyness, as I will use it when I install it there. Maybe I'll install it to compile this and other projects...)

Well, Ive got to thank you too! It forced me to take another look at the airport state machine, and I managed to track down and solve the issue near the northern hangar that was causing the graphics glitch. Ive watched it for over 20 game years handling 40 aircraft, and didnt see a single hiccup.

There is just one more thing to resolve: why planes always seem to pick from the first terminals, rather than from the nearest group. It looks like FindFreeTerminal is getting called before it reaches where I think it should be called. So it has pre-selected the terminal, before it has even landed!! I was most surprised by this, and will have to track it down.

ebik · Post by **ebik** » 28 Mar 2006 13:30

richk67 wrote:OK, Ive nearly solved it, and you will be able to get your aircraft back too. The blocking aircraft is Aircraft 24 on Term8. It wants the hangar and has reserved it. But it cant leave cos Aircraft 12 has reserved the taxiway. I can override this by giving Aircraft 24 the taxiway as well.

Hmm, I compiled your v2 patch agains trunk, and when I try to load my or your savegame I get:

Code: Select all

openttd-airpt-r4139: station_map.c:18: GetStationType: Assertion `IsBuoy_(t)' failed.

I use following script for compiling. First argument is subdirectory with openttd tree, name of this subdirectory then appears in 'revision' string and in directory where openttd is then installed.

Code: Select all

#!/bin/bash
PATH=/usr/bin:"$PATH"
A="${1%/}"
shift
PREFIX="$HOME/BIG/usr/"
DATA_PREFIX="share/openttd/"
DATA_DIR="$DATA_PREFIX/$A"
WINDATA_DIR="$PREFIX/$DATA_PREFIX/data/"
DATA_BREF=
make -C "$A" REV="$A" EXE="-$A" UNIX=1 WITH_ZLIB=1 WITH_SDL=1 WITH_PNG=1 INSTALL=1 \
     PREFIX=$PREFIX BINARY_DIR=bin DATA_DIR=$DATA_DIR \
     ICON_DIR="$DATA_DIR" PERSONAL_DIR=.openttd USE_HOMEDIR=1 "$@"

if [ "x$1" == xinstall ]; then
  if [ -d "$WINDATA_DIR" ]; then
    echo data already installed..
  else
    mkdir -p "$WINDATA_DIR"
    cp install-data/* "$WINDATA_DIR"
  fi

  export WINDATA_DIR A
  ( cd "$WINDATA_DIR"; for i in *; do ln -sf ../../data/$i ../"$A"/data/$i; done)
fi

And I use it as following:

Code: Select all

./make.sh airpt-r4139
./make.sh airpt-r4139 install

ebik · Post by **ebik** » 28 Mar 2006 16:05

ebik wrote:Hmm, I compiled your v2 patch agains trunk, and when I try to load my or your savegame I get:
Code: Select all
openttd-airpt-r4139: station_map.c:18: GetStationType: Assertion `IsBuoy_(t)' failed.

It works under revision r4109 (from nightly archives), so there is some recent change that may 'invalidate' your patch.

So thank you again, now I can play savegame you posted me.

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 28 Mar 2006 16:56

ebik wrote:
ebik wrote:Hmm, I compiled your v2 patch agains trunk, and when I try to load my or your savegame I get:
Code: Select all
openttd-airpt-r4139: station_map.c:18: GetStationType: Assertion `IsBuoy_(t)' failed.
It works under revision r4109 (from nightly archives), so there is some recent change that may 'invalidate' your patch.

So thank you again, now I can play savegame you posted me.

OK... another thing to hunt

I will check whether this is a savegame issue for trunk or whether it is just the airports patch that suffers.

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 28 Mar 2006 21:15

richk67 wrote:OK... another thing to hunt I will check whether this is a savegame issue for trunk or whether it is just the airports patch that suffers.

OK, found that one. There is a new feature which assumes that if a station tile has not been assigned (which for an existing game it wont have been), that it is a Buoy tile. I now explicitly check for a Buoy, and if not, return an AIRPORT tile. Not great, but then, the new code aggressively assumes the data state.

Anyway ....

FINISHED! The airport now selects the nearest terminal group, so aircraft landing at left dont now taxi all around the airport to terminal 1. I have run this for 20+ game years, with 40 aircraft, and no visible collisions/hangs/etc.

New patch posted in original thread.

ebik · Post by **ebik** » 29 Mar 2006 10:52

I have another probleb with my (and your) savegame:
If you load it, and watch "New Pinnpool Airport", few days later (9th Nov 2034) plane heading to southern takeoff, stops and waits before terminals. (So I think it has clear way...). May be this is save/load problem, but I don't know.

EDIT: solved by sending all aircrafts to hangar and sell/rebuild/buy.

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 30 Mar 2006 00:10

Here are three ideas for a long & thin airport, inspired by Brianetta's suggestion.

What do people prefer; type 1, type 2, or type 3?

(For the moment, imagine that the fence orientations have been sorted... I'm not going to spend time on that and then scrap the airport design!)

type 3 extended - length 6 runways. splits into a heliport section (with own hangar), and an aircraft section. aircraft will never visit the heliport hangar, unless built there

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 30 Mar 2006 03:21

BTW - I have now programmed the aircraft side of the Type 3 airport. I still need to code the helipad side. Im thinking about calling it a District Airport. Any other ideas? Regional?

Brianetta · Post by **Brianetta** » 30 Mar 2006 08:39

I like the type 3 extended (naturally - it's closest to my original sketch). I take it that airports must be rectangular? The shape of these airports allows them to be used in some places where a large square area is not available. Having the odd corner knocked off would increase the chances of a fit.

For the curious, this is what amounted to my original suggestion. As you can see, I can't really take any credit!

Jango · Post by **Jango** » 30 Mar 2006 10:20

i think it's unrealistic to have anything other than type 1. In any real world scenario it would be too dangerous to have 2 runways on the same axis like in type 2 and 3.

Brianetta · Post by **Brianetta** » 30 Mar 2006 10:29

How about having the runways at opposing corners? Then they are still at opposite ends of the airport, but are not in line.

In any case, it's not normally the case that an airport has two runways, one dedicated for takeoff and one for landing. Those few large airports with two parallel runways use both for both, with the longer one being for larger aircraft.

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 30 Mar 2006 12:26

Jango wrote:i think it's unrealistic to have anything other than type 1. In any real world scenario it would be too dangerous to have 2 runways on the same axis like in type 2 and 3.

Type 1 is quite compact, and has an OK flow - I may make that one work as well! The flow through the Type 3 airport will be much smoother. Inbound aircraft can go straight to hangar, and not interfere with takeoff or taxi movements, and helicopters are totally segregated. (In fact the helicopter area of the type 3 might make a nice 2x3 standalone heliport.)

I experimented with inbound on one side, outbound on the other, but you ended up with a lot of wasted taxiway space. With it only 3 wide, there isnt space for a runway, a taxiway, a terminal, and a building.

Going to 4 tiles wide makes life a LOT easier, but then that width is already catered for.

And I always return to this: OTTD is a game, not a simulation of real life. We can pick and mix which bits of real world apply. For ease of use, unrealistic runway lengths are used. (I think ground scale is meant to be 1tile=25m. Even if its 50m, it is not unusual for a "normal" runway to be 2000m - ie. 40 tiles @ 50m!)

MeusH · Post by **MeusH** » 30 Mar 2006 19:08

Jango wrote:i think it's unrealistic to have anything other than type 1. In any real world scenario it would be too dangerous to have 2 runways on the same axis like in type 2 and 3.

I second that.
It is true that OpenTTD is game, but there is no point of making such an unrealistic airports. There are no airports with a runway crossed by a building or transmitter, or with two runways and something inbetween.

There is one Alltaken's airport layout - long and thin - please consider that. It's on Alltaken's webpage, I may give you a link

ebik · Post by **ebik** » 30 Mar 2006 20:35

richk67 wrote:
Jango wrote:i think it's unrealistic to have anything other than type 1. In any real world scenario it would be too dangerous to have 2 runways on the same axis like in type 2 and 3.
Type 1 is quite compact, and has an OK flow - I may make that one work as well! The flow through the Type 3 airport will be much smoother. Inbound aircraft can go straight to hangar, and not interfere with takeoff or taxi movements, and helicopters are totally segregated. (In fact the helicopter area of the type 3 might make a nice 2x3 standalone heliport.)

I experimented with inbound on one side, outbound on the other, but you ended up with a lot of wasted taxiway space. With it only 3 wide, there isnt space for a runway, a taxiway, a terminal, and a building.

Going to 4 tiles wide makes life a LOT easier, but then that width is already catered for.

And I always return to this: OTTD is a game, not a simulation of real life. We can pick and mix which bits of real world apply. For ease of use, unrealistic runway lengths are used. (I think ground scale is meant to be 1tile=25m. Even if its 50m, it is not unusual for a "normal" runway to be 2000m - ie. 40 tiles @ 50m!)

Passenger carriages are about 25m long, cargo wagons about 15m. But another scale is for long distances, time has double scale also (one hour (in speed mph) last several days... I think that for length we shoud use rule that anything that looks and feels good is ok.

Anyway lefthand side of Type 3 can have runway on opposite side. (switch place with helis, tower and depot...).

I think, it should be not problem to have non-square airpot, but...:

For this airports, both orientations will be great. But for non-square airports there should be all four orientations, which can be too much complex for gui.

P.S.: cosmetics: Radar on intercontinental does not rotate.

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 30 Mar 2006 22:11

ebik wrote:P.S.: cosmetics: Radar on intercontinental does not rotate.

Does on mine! Are you using a non-standard grf?

sjabby · Post by **sjabby** » 30 Mar 2006 22:17

i dont understand the compiling thingy is there another way to get this airport to work on my system?

ebik · Post by **ebik** » 30 Mar 2006 22:56

richk67 wrote:
ebik wrote:P.S.: cosmetics: Radar on intercontinental does not rotate.
Does on mine! Are you using a non-standard grf?

Okay, it does rotate. But sometimes not, (e.g. immediately after build, also the delay vary...), maybe this is intended behaviour. It confused me.

EDIT: try to load that savegame that you posted me, there is the time to start rotating so long, that I thought they never rotates. (It is more than game-year).

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 30 Mar 2006 23:28

ebik wrote:
richk67 wrote:
ebik wrote:P.S.: cosmetics: Radar on intercontinental does not rotate.
Does on mine! Are you using a non-standard grf?
Okay, it does rotate. But sometimes not, (e.g. immediately after build, also the delay vary...), maybe this is intended behaviour. It confused me.

EDIT: try to load that savegame that you posted me, there is the time to start rotating so long, that I thought they never rotates. (It is more than game-year).

Dunno... i didnt touch it

(blames someone else

)

richk67 · Post by **richk67** » 30 Mar 2006 23:33

OK... since Type 3 was so popular, I have stopped work on it. Here is a new design, where the passengers get bussed to their aircraft like at holiday airports (eg. Mahon on Menorca), rather than the aircraft docking with a building.

This allows an interesting aircraft operation: they arrive at the terminal pad from one side - but leave to the opposite side. This way it keeps a strict path through the airport, which should avoid conflicts, or long waits.

I will need a new hangar design though, that points to the NE (if vertical is N). Any artists want to volunteer?

Comments? Worth coding? Would you use it?

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