Callback on reversing train

krtaylor · Post by **krtaylor** » 25 May 2006 11:43

I mean, a situation where the single loco is in the middle of the train, is not real common and never has been. There are situations with modern high-speed trains in which the power car is in the middle, with cabs at both ends, but that's not really relevant to the external appearance of the train in TTD.

michael blunck · Post by **michael blunck** » 25 May 2006 11:53

> a situation where the single loco is in the middle of the train, is not real common and never has been.

Well, I don´t know what you mean with "real common" but AFAIR locomotives have indeed been used in this way, at least in the U.K, in Switzerland and in Germany.

Admittedly, that would have been more unusual as ordinary pull-push service.

regards
Michael

Post by **Dave** » 25 May 2006 16:17

krtaylor wrote:It's not real common in any case, is it? Even less so that ordinary push/pull services.

In the British Age of Steam, tank engines often faced the wrong way for pulling, or pushed because turntables weren't available or far away. Also time constraints meant that sometimes engines would just have carriages or wagons attached to the front to save time and keep the other line free.

Fair enough, Push/pull wasn't as common.

The UKRS has got it 50% right - with tank engines either pulling facing forwards or backwards. All we need now is the possibility of pushing either forwards or backwards - which is what Michael is attempting to implement.

And I really can't wait for Pikka to make it work! It'll be like walking into 1930s Britain! Brilliant!

m3henry · Post by **m3henry** » 25 May 2006 17:02

that reminmds me of a train that had a special dmu trailing carridge that could control the engine at the front. it was british rail diesil, but do not ask me what it is

krtaylor · Post by **krtaylor** » 26 May 2006 00:53

Those are actually very common in US commuter railroads, in fact almost standard equipment.

Post by **PikkaBird** » 27 May 2006 14:14

Patchman,

If I don't manage to get you on irc before you read this: can you please update the consist callback when leaving the depot, as well as when reversing (I think we spoke about this a while ago, it will let me re-randomise my steam loco orientations too

).

Post by **PikkaBird** » 27 May 2006 16:28

Here we go...

The Irish · Post by **The Irish** » 27 May 2006 22:02

This is just awsome... Looking forward to an update of UKRS and of DBXL

Keep up the good work, guys...

Post by **Dave** » 27 May 2006 22:11

Someone please send Pikka a crate of alcohol. PLEASE.

WOW!

broodje · Post by **broodje** » 28 May 2006 00:17

Maybe something useful (aka not only sweet graphics, although I really like them) could be made of this? Trains with a loco at the front that have to 'run around' need some time to turn, while DMUs and EMUs can turn instantly, like they do now?
To make it even more interesting: tender locomotives won't have to be turned on a turntable so they could be faster in turning around as a normal steam engine. This way there would be a difference between the slower local-dmu/emu (top speed wise) and the fast loco hauled trains.
Or would this be unnecessarily complicated?

michael blunck · Post by **michael blunck** » 28 May 2006 07:27

[push-pull trains clearing faster]

> Maybe something useful [...]

Something like this has been already proposed to Josef, however it´ll be not in the final Beta.

regards
Michael

Snail · Post by **Snail** » 28 May 2006 20:41

michael blunck wrote:> a situation where the single loco is in the middle of the train, is not real common and never has been.

Well, I don´t know what you mean with "real common" but AFAIR locomotives have indeed been used in this way, at least in the U.K, in Switzerland and in Germany.l

Add France (the Dromadaire).

Anyhow, if what Pikka drew showed us can actually be implemented in a game (i.e. letting trains reverse so that the engine pushes the train instead of pulling it, like it happens in Locomotion with driving cars) the FRSet will use it for sure as well. Our tank steamers are ready for push-pull service already! It's a pity that we cannot let commuter trains reverse more quickly than long-distance trains...

michael blunck · Post by **michael blunck** » 28 May 2006 21:02

> Add France

[x]

> if what Pikka drew showed us can actually be implemented [...]

It is already implemented.

> [FRSet] Our tank steamers are ready for push-pull service already!

Well, AFAIR, having tank engines available doesn´t necissarily mean they have been used in push-pull services ...

> It's a pity that we cannot let commuter trains reverse more quickly than long-distance trains.

http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php ... llback_12_

regards
Michael

Snail · Post by **Snail** » 29 May 2006 00:54

Whoops... sorry

That's great news anyway!

wallyweb · Post by **wallyweb** » 30 Nov 2006 07:48

When using Pikkabird's implementation of reversing trains, if a consist is non-symetrical (mixed), the illusion is spoiled because the consist sequence flips as in when push/pull is not enabled.
Has any work been done on preserving the sequence of the consist when a train reverses?
Related to this, the engine's orientation is flipped, giving the illusion that there is still a magic turntable for the engine.
I understand that the reversing process follows this sequence:

1. Flip entire train as per unpatched TTDX
2. Swap engine and trailer graphics back to their original positions.

Unfortunately the engine's orientation is also flipped in step 1. Is it possible to preserve or reestablish the original orientation?

michael blunck · Post by **michael blunck** » 30 Nov 2006 09:03

> Has any work been done on preserving the sequence of the consist when a train reverses?

As I explained here http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=524093#524093 this is impossible to do from inside a .grf but instead has to be implemented in TTDPatch. Bad news is that this is postponed after 2.5 (or 2.6?).

> Unfortunately the engine's orientation is also flipped in step 1. Is it possible to preserve or reestablish the original orientation?

That´s indeed possible.

ATM, this whole thing isn´t much more than a fancy experiment. I´ve spoilt many hours to improve it but alone to avoid "mixed consists" is a tedious venture.

regards
Michael

wallyweb · Post by **wallyweb** » 30 Nov 2006 13:07

Thank you Michael. Your reply is greatly appreciated.

michael blunck wrote:> Has any work been done on preserving the sequence of the consist when a train reverses?

As I explained here http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=524093#524093 this is impossible to do from inside a .grf but instead has to be implemented in TTDPatch. Bad news is that this is postponed after 2.5 (or 2.6?).

Heh. From now on I'll have to include the OpenTT forums in my searches.

/me adds that thread to my watch list.

michael blunck wrote:> Unfortunately the engine's orientation is also flipped in step 1. Is it possible to preserve or reestablish the original orientation?

That´s indeed possible.

Good.

michael blunck wrote:ATM, this whole thing isn´t much more than a fancy experiment. I´ve spoilt many hours to improve it but alone to avoid "mixed consists" is a tedious venture.

But think of the possibilities once the experiment is done and the proof is published. All those "spoilt hours" will suddenly seem so very valuable you will want to brag about them to your grandchildren.

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